December 01, 2021, 03:47:14 am

The Gang Garrison 2 Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

NOTICE: Due to a rise in bot activity, new posters need to be approved before posting.

Join the community Discord server!

Pages: [1]

Author Topic:  (Read 1555 times)

Spazz

  • Seasoned Member
  • *****
  • Karma: 44
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1933
  • Almost too much seasoning.
« on: May 23, 2018, 02:10:00 am »



-TO DO
> A LOT

Weight comparison as there was some discussion on this before,
(click to show/hide)




Next on the list;
>Set up second set of (Basic) Room(s) and Menu(s)
>Build child and paged layers (Decide on authentic pages, or scroll bar)
>Set up interaction between menus (Destroy, Create)
>Remove Paper2D's animations and index any class to start testing physics
>Plan first set of (Advanced) Room(s) and Menu(s)

Later on list;
>Resize layouts
>Exchange default images with MasterS imagery
>Variables in Options menu actually doing something
>First Options Variable test, menu sound (music from MasterS)

Currently on hold;
<N/A>

Completed;
>Gather Master files of original demake from MedO's github (MasterS)
>Set up update bio/thread (a bit late but no matter)
>Set up Source inside Paper2D to start work
>Set up first set of (Basic) Room(s) and Menu(s)

Error;
>Failed to get to bed on time, third day in a row from research on How2 anything and everything.
Logged

<3 Bustatunez

Kevin Kuntz

  • Heroic Member
  • ****
  • Karma: -58
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 712
  • panda took the kids
    • Rav And Kill Bill
Re:
« Reply #1 on: May 23, 2018, 03:57:54 am »

ow, ok good luck
i suggest the name "gg3d"
« Last Edit: May 23, 2018, 10:13:48 am by Kevin Kuntz »
Logged
I PEAKED
I PEAKED

Haxton Sale

  • The only true
  • Haxxy Organizer
  • *
  • Karma: 18
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3542
  • HAXTON SAAAAAAAAAAALE!
Re:
« Reply #2 on: May 26, 2018, 04:30:59 am »

But please make it easily upgradable in terms of graphics and such. I'd really love those high-framerate animations to get some love, maybe even an all-new high-def look.
Logged
THIS POST GOT SIGNED BY

Spazz

  • Seasoned Member
  • *****
  • Karma: 44
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1933
  • Almost too much seasoning.
Re:
« Reply #3 on: May 26, 2018, 06:19:10 am »

i suggest the name "gg3d"
GG2u(nreal) for now until there's a better fitting name

But please make it easily upgradable in terms of graphics and such. I'd really love those high-framerate animations to get some love, maybe even an all-new high-def look.
Ideas are there, however how to approach them is in question.

Do I allow Skins to cover Pixel Density and Animation Frames? Or do I create Object the Classes to explicitly detail while having a slider to limit/extend the Animations?

Example of what I mean for the former, is just a clickable button in the options to select a file for a skin override, which would be a set amount of detail and frames. Where as latter, would have a Slider to choose which level of Animation (2frame, 4frame, etc) while the clickable button would be some weird file to detail the objects of players, and by objects I mean torso, right arm, left leg, etc. I need to find an example that is easily understood, but think of the Classes as a bag of individual not-bloody gibs that are attached and being told what their detail is independently.

For maps, I'd love to add a 3D parallax effect on the detail layer (Ex: youtu.be/oq7XsAneDgk) and incorporate lighting in some fashion. Like sunbeams from top open maps, or add tools/entities for spotlights, torches or tube lights. Plenty of other things, but all an idea until much later.

Might handle it like Master Chief Collection, having an original render and a one button switch to upgraded graphics render.

Question becomes though, this isn't *some remake in GG2 where I can just copy paste solutions and credit people. I'm recreating from scratch besides sprites and sound among other bits. What the literal hell do I do about Crediting. Do I still credit the original team and contributes for the 'original game' and 'concepts to build off of'?

This has me puzzled.
« Last Edit: September 15, 2018, 11:23:36 pm by Spazz »
Logged

<3 Bustatunez

Haxton Sale

  • The only true
  • Haxxy Organizer
  • *
  • Karma: 18
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3542
  • HAXTON SAAAAAAAAAAALE!
Re:
« Reply #4 on: May 26, 2018, 07:29:43 am »

I'd say credit the idea ("Based on GG2 by MrFredman" or whoever else) and creators of the assets you actually use.

As for graphics, what I had in mind was for you to be able to replace the animations permanently later on. What's the point of remaking GG2 on a new engine if it's not gonna look any better. The era of atari graphics being considered "fine" for indie titles is long gone imo, and I don't believe you can make an argument for them adding any sort of charm or character.

In general, I appreciate that you tried to recreate the original menu and resolution, but you shouldn't try to emulate the limitations and shortcomings of the original on purpose. If you actually want to finish this project, just focus on making a "simplified 2D version of TF2" instead of "1:1 GG2 remake in another engine".
Logged
THIS POST GOT SIGNED BY

Spazz

  • Seasoned Member
  • *****
  • Karma: 44
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1933
  • Almost too much seasoning.
Re:
« Reply #5 on: May 26, 2018, 08:06:21 am »

It all can be taken a number of ways, but at the current point I do not have the experience required to stray too far from 1:1 without diving through pages to find a solution. So for now it's going to be a direct remake and once I'm confident enough to take on larger tasks will I look broader

While I understand your point, you might want to build a larger idea and examples as this is my first real attempt to do anything in UE4, and most of my experience is that n from Source SDK mapping.

Also I'm no artist but I've got a few modellers I can question, sort of a Game and Watch vs Cpt.Falcon concept
« Last Edit: May 26, 2018, 09:19:37 am by Spazz »
Logged

<3 Bustatunez

Haxton Sale

  • The only true
  • Haxxy Organizer
  • *
  • Karma: 18
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3542
  • HAXTON SAAAAAAAAAAALE!
Re:
« Reply #6 on: May 26, 2018, 09:51:42 am »

Oh I never said anything about 3D, all I meant was to maybe use some of the higher-framerate, or more stylized, or higher-resolution art. There's a lot of it laying around on the forum, I could make some too eventually. And yeah, I think there's no need to keep the game windowed or capped at this weird screen ratio the original uses.

As far as basic game design, I know it's much too early for it, but let me share one main thought that's always been with me.
What makes GG2 so fun for me is really the horizontal map design. Many 2D shooters (Teeworlds etc.) think they need to compensate for the lack of the 3rd dimension and make the maps very vertical, to the point where they feel like mazes. Gang Garrison always felt kind of like MOBA in that regard, with teams coming from two sides and splitting into 2 or 3 lanes, with maybe some extra routes for more agile classes.
Also, the MOBA gamemode was the most fun I've had in GG2 when it was a thing. Please include it, it's just generator with pre-spawned turrets and npc drones which follow scripted paths.

Also, have you looked into networking yet? I have a feeling it might be the hardest part to do.
Logged
THIS POST GOT SIGNED BY

MedO

  • Owns this place
  • *****
  • Karma: 151
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1751
Re:
« Reply #7 on: May 26, 2018, 12:29:45 pm »

It looks like Unreal Engine has some pretty strong support for networking built-in, so it's probably not too hard to get a better networking experience than gg2 has with much less effort.
Logged
Quote from: Alfred North Whitehead
It is the business of the future to be dangerous; and it is among the merits of science that it equips the future for its duties.

Quote from: John Carmack
[...] if you have a large enough codebase, any class of error that is syntactically legal probably exists there.

Spazz

  • Seasoned Member
  • *****
  • Karma: 44
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1933
  • Almost too much seasoning.
Re:
« Reply #8 on: May 26, 2018, 05:21:58 pm »

Networking might be a terrifying experience, would probably call upon help for that.

If plugins are possible, depending on what "possible" means with UE4, handling them could be a special matter. That also includes the Source, as both being Open Source would allow for dissection and unfair advantages to occur. I'll be researching on that later when the time comes, however I'm hoping I can lock it down to disallow unapproved recompiles and have an approval plugin/mod system, while being loose enough to allow anyone to write what they want.

Maybe I'll also forgo Payload causing Bass yet more work :whistle:
Logged

<3 Bustatunez

Spazz

  • Seasoned Member
  • *****
  • Karma: 44
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1933
  • Almost too much seasoning.
Re:
« Reply #9 on: August 05, 2018, 12:36:40 am »

Not gonna lie, this is pretty much dead.

Reason being is the guy I would chat with almost everyday for hours about all things code, including this project, died last month. The community we were part of has shattered as it was a tight knit and some knew him personally. Worse still my personal life also flipped upside down.

I'm currently going to be too busy building my electrician career to have time for this project but it's still very much a goal. I'll still post now and then but probably not here for a while. If I get my PC up and running sometime in the next few months, I'll probably post a gif of the red soldier I had running around firing rockets. If I remember, that is.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2018, 11:29:35 am by Spazz »
Logged

<3 Bustatunez

Spazz

  • Seasoned Member
  • *****
  • Karma: 44
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1933
  • Almost too much seasoning.
Re:
« Reply #10 on: April 09, 2019, 10:23:09 pm »

Looks like the menu gif gag expired, what a shame.

So I've been jotting down what the do's and don'ts have been, where to first, what to learn that I do not and really just an overall plan. While most of it is likely overthinking and understated of being too big of a bite to chew, frankly this is just a fun project to blow off steam or a creative influx. More of the latter in almost all cases, because UE4 is fun while Source is difficult and GM, for the life of me, is beyond reason even though it's hailed as a starter engine.

So the service(s) to be provided would obviously include;
- Appropriate menus,
- Game to be played,
- Hosting possibilities,
- Service for Updater and Banners
- Map Builder built in from the get-go,
- As much support I can provide for reward replica
- The rest I've glossed over

The menus, as already seen, are clearly nothing to sneeze at, easy stuff. Where the challenge comes in would be the game, the networking, and the builder.

Where my current interest rests is maps and mapping. How GM GG2 handles the maps is half understood or less, I can apply my knowledge to have a working map but in the virtual space and the theory/code to it is out of reach unless someone wants to explain it. Like I've mentioned, GM as an engine is likely not something I'll bother with, especially for where I want to go, even though it's not my field, lol.

The idea I've got is taking in a bit from every experience I've run into across the board, though also twisting it to be useful in what I want to achieve. While it may be inefficient, it's not final as the suggestion box is always open.

- It's built in from first release
- Provides all available/supported modes
- Limits the Entities to game mode if selected
- Opens all Entities when selecting free mode, but red shifts conflictions
- Help archive, to explain functionality and hidden mechanics
- Tutorial, to explain how it all works from basic to more advanced stuff
- Has LOGIC, to allow advanced interactive or other inputs
- Create a check to the [service] for updates, whether it be add/remove/change
- Dedicated banner link with preview inside the Builder menu for latest update news
- Others I'm forgetting

Then, what about how maps work at all? Before I became concerned with the mechanics, what was I to do about it as a file. The whole idea that GM GG2 has for embedding extra data into the .png is both amazing and terrible. Keeps and easy to exchange, some upload hosts destroy the extra data. Pros, Cons.

However, hopefully I can take a more direct route with UE4. Just zip the files. Exchange the zip, extract to cache or black magic for use when needed. Similar to .bsp from TF2. Maybe I'm making light of this, who knows.

As for internally. Layers, right, but how? The idea going has been to segregate rather explicitly. Layer0 would be the default collision and entities for that layer, Layer1 would be default background for the colour and forground sprites. Standard right? Maybe you caught what I was implying next.

What about map altercations? Some TF2 maps are dynamic and change depending on what happens either through gamemode or mapper creation for user activation, which is probably complicated and may be confusing, but I'll be damned if it's not an option. What if Layer-1 replaced Layer0 for collision, and Layer2 replaced Layer1 for background?

Better yet, why stick to "Layer"? LOGIC could easily cover the connections to have BG#, WM#, ENT#, etc, explicitly running and overwriting the correct data. Three stage ADCP? No need to stretch out the map so normal view or Rifleman's zoom can't see it, the layers are invisible until needed.

Quite the runaway train of thought.
Logged

<3 Bustatunez
Pages: [1]
 

Page created in 0.049 seconds with 35 queries.