What's your opinion on the core gameplay of GG2?

[Teekytots [PC:CWD]]

You know what? Eliminate the spy.

I don't care how many balancedness this creates, because after a few seconds, it becomes apparent that it wouldn't matter. I have yet to meet the spy who is not part autistic. It has a learning curve steeper than the Demo's, but with half the usefulness. You can't communicate with them without giving away their position, every 5-year-old trying out the game instantly picks it and stands behind a crate, it has little to no defensive value. The revolver, while arguably the best weapon in the game, is almost never used.

Now, imagine all of these flaws, but with 5 team members who can't get past a single sentry thinking that a spy would be the best solution. Class limits won't do crap, and there's no mods to the class that can make it balanced yet useful.

One more suggestion like this, thread locking in an instant.

I really want to lock this thread  because it's becoming a thread for dumping ideas. yayayay

[[GA]10char]

I'm fine with the game how it is to be honest, save the lack of servers :/

[Exploding Pancakes]

stuff

I think this is a really, really good idea. Coding this might be tough, but it'd really help, I think.

Also, regarding the spy. I think he need a redesign: We should buff the knife and maybe the revolver and nerf the cloak.

The problem i see with spies is that they can become very passive during a match, chilling around in one spot and waiting for a good stab moment. A knife that would work better without the cloak (faster stab? ability to move while stabbing?) and maybe a stronger revolver would encourage a more active approach to the game.

[trog]

Honestly trying to fix spy's learning curve is too much work. There have been countless threads with countless pages, but in the end spy needs an overhaul to fix him, and no one wants to do an overhaul.

Tips telling spies to uncloak wouldn't be too hard though.

[Exploding Pancakes]

quite honestly its not that the spy is weak, its that the players are idiots while using him.

the illusion of easy gameplay which they get from not being seen is what makes them play the class, + the stabs.

you cant solve spys problem by buffing him imo, you need to make spying harder so the newbies drop the class from their favorites.


this is how i feel, now excuse me while i fetch my umbrella, theres a shitstorm ahead for me.

also whats so hard with the hints?
when a team mate is on fire and youre a pyro, that thing pops up
if your team has no medics in an arena match, it would say
"a medic in your team can save you from failing whole matches, you should think of playing him, he gets assist kills and is the most liked team member."

I agree that players probably feel drawn to the spy because they die less while playing him and they can be invisible for as long as they want, something that sounds awesome in theory but honestly doesn't add up to very much in practice. Making spy "harder" wouldn't be the goal IMO, the goal would be to make the spy less focused on slow stabs and camping around while invisible and more focused on cloaked runs and revolvering.

I can think of a few ways to do this: Limited cloak, slower move speed while cloaked and a stronger revolver. Limited cloak would mean that spies would have to plan their attack in advance and not just stand around invisible, creating a different-paced play and a larger emphasis on passive invisibility. The slower move speed would be a variation on that, making long cloaked movement harder. Changing the revolver might not be the best idea since it'll most likely be a direct buff but imo, anything that moves the spy away from the slot-filling and quite useless role he has now would be appreciated.

[trog]

People have already asked for it, and as you can see nothing has really happened. Your best bet is to find someone who can code and get a working mod with a couple tips in it, then make a thread asking for more ideas for tips.

[Malpracticeisdead]

I don't like having those tips appear in a server. Seems like unnecessary clutter. I'd rather have them in the menus or something.

[Dinomite]

Or maybe have a training mode sort of thing like TF2's.

[Killah Zillah]

I like Raivo's idea

As do I! Something similar to L4D's tip scheme..! It would also tell you that you can airblast flares back if you're pyro and you get hit with a flare!

With a hints system, we could see the skill level of the ENTIRE newbie community jump like it found a spider under its toilet seat!

[Tibbles]

Mmmm...toilet seats.

This is a good idea.  Tips and noobs are always a great combination.  The tip ubers the noob to perform beyond their certifications of Noobity and into a Jr. Member scholarship!

[Teekytots [PC:CWD]]

Or maybe have a training mode sort of thing like TF2's.

It's really hard to do this, but it can work.

[Musashi-COM]

Buff (the Spy's) combat effectiveness, maybe overhaul the cloak, maybe rethink the stab, buff the revolver again, and change his default effectiveness / skill needed ratio.

Stuff is broken, and can't be fixed because it's internal parts were built and put together so that it can't help but to endlessly break itself. So, what do you do? You start from scratch, get new parts, rebuild your stuff in a different fashion, test the fuck out of it, and hopefully it'll last. Rethink the class.

Whatever happened to the "don't be afraid to test out new and insane stuff" part of the game's development? What was that called? Beta testing? Coding new gameplay concepts and replacing older ones that need reworking, throw some lab rats in it, and see their reaction? Is that thing even working, or are beta testers so up their asses that they can't work without someone refuting any type of change? Who were the dumbasses that let 2.3.0 rocketjumping unnerfed? Because that was seriously gamebreaking, and it took a build to find a sort of sweet spot. That's bad-no, that's terrible.

About tips, I agree. Although I wouldn't be so hopeful about pubs getting any better.

[Tibbles]

About tips, I agree. Although I wouldn't be so hopeful about pubs getting any better.

You never know, Musashi.  They may actually follow the tips, or they may turn them off.  Lets try to go with the former.

[Orpheon]

Or maybe have a training mode sort of thing like TF2's.

It's really hard to do this, but it can work.

You'd need to simulate a match with people doing everything the same...... you know what this reminds me of? The replay system. We all play a carefully planned and coordinated match, and record every command. The hard part is making some things only happen when the newbie does something without making everything blocky...

(sorry for derailing)

[Fugitive]

Buff (the Spy's) combat effectiveness, maybe overhaul the cloak, maybe rethink the stab, buff the revolver again, and change his default effectiveness / skill needed ratio.

Stuff is broken, and can't be fixed because it's internal parts were built and put together so that it can't help but to endlessly break itself. So, what do you do? You start from scratch, get new parts, rebuild your stuff in a different fashion, test the fuck out of it, and hopefully it'll last. Rethink the class.

Whatever happened to the "don't be afraid to test out new and insane stuff" part of the game's development? What was that called? Beta testing? Coding new gameplay concepts and replacing older ones that need reworking, throw some lab rats in it, and see their reaction? Is that thing even working, or are beta testers so up their asses that they can't work without someone refuting any type of change? Who were the dumbasses that let 2.3.0 rocketjumping unnerfed? Because that was seriously gamebreaking, and it took a build to find a sort of sweet spot. That's bad-no, that's terrible.

About tips, I agree. Although I wouldn't be so hopeful about pubs getting any better.

The problem is that there are so few people who can actually use GM8, so things can only be tested as fast as they can code them.